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Half dance, half juggling, half mime, half magic....I'm a contact juggler, not a mathematician
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alarming trend in contact juggling
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Drew



Joined: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 989
Location: Bristol UK

Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:09 pm    Post subject:

Mmmmm Marmite is lush
Nutella is lush too
I'm bispreadable you see
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RaRanax



Joined: 10 Mar 2005
Posts: 72
Location: Portland

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:03 am    Post subject: Conversating with a blind magician

I feel inclined to my two cents. (don't read most of this, does not make sense)
A few days ago I had a very good talk about this sort subject with a blind magician after his show.
To some magicians any type of magic or slight of hand is juggling, only mental magic is true magic. People have problems with contact juggling as juggling, how many times have you heard: "but he/she is not throwing the ball!"? There are pattern jugglers and there are number jugglers.
We all must juggle to please ourselves and our audiences. The elevator gets OOs and Ahhs from and audience, but getting smoothly into a fist hold simply gets a look of interest. How many hours of practice to these tricks take to become proficient? I know I got the elevator in about ten min and the fist hold over a week.
I find that dancing when I juggle is just fun. I do not do it to impress I do it because I like it. I agree that I can dance better and have more fun with more practice and I enjoy the practice, I win both ways.

I think the best jugglers are the ones who find the middle ground. the ones who can pander to their audiences and still learn new and amazing tricks. Like the blind magician said: for the audience the tricks are immaterial, unless your audience are all magicians, it is your audience that hold them.
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quarter dance, quarter juggling, quarter mime, quarter magic....I'm a contact juggler, and a math major.
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daydream
MoM Mobsta



Joined: 04 Aug 2004
Posts: 725
Location: Vancouver

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 8:51 am    Post subject:

Drew wrote:
I'm bispreadable you see


Bispreadable man! where have you been all my life!?! this one spread life style just is not satifying my yurn for multilpe flavors! Can you save me before utter doom takes over this pety life?

...

yeah, it's late, ok...
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The Manipulator



Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 54

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 12:28 pm    Post subject:

Drew wrote:
OT
Mr the manipulator,
For multiball madness you prabably want to talk to me or pich.
Theres 2 reasons why we haven't posted any videos online, and both of them will be released around autumn.



I anticipate their arrival. Actually, I was trying to find out if anyone has broken the 6 ball palm-spin, with one hand. I'm having a bugger of a time and it's driving me nuts. I read that if you can hold it in your hand, you can spin it, and I can hold them in my hand, but... I figure if I can do 5, someone can do 6. I'm getting the 6 ball stack down, but it's going to take awhile. These old, over-used hands are having a hard time.

I really want a copy of those releases. I've not seen much juggling, other than my own. I've lived a very, very sheltered life, (that's a whole other story). I saw my first juggler at 20, and only a handful since. I was 41 before I saw any contact juggling, and that was for about 10 seconds. I was so ignorant, I taught myself with tennis balls and thought myself stupid because it took so long to make them spin as smoothly as the ones I saw the other guy spinning, (the other guy turned out to be Moeshen). I didn't see any more contact juggling till about 4 months ago. You see, I just don't know where everybody is at, and where I fit in the scheme of things, I just know that I love it, and I need to perform for the first time in my life. I just regret I wasn't introduced to this 20 years ago.

At least there are 2 reasons why I couldn't find any videos. Thanks Drew. Let me know about that 6 ball palm-spin. My hat's off to you if you broke that barrier.

Thomas Geist
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The Manipulator



Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 54

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 12:52 pm    Post subject:

This is interesting reading and I've been trying to decide whether to comment. I see someone keeping the wasp nest stirred, because they like reading the responses, or someone that doesn't know when to apologize and bite their tongue. Either way it's no skin off my teeth. Anything you do that has been done is not copying, you're just doing something your way. If you do 2 things at the same time it is something new. I like to twirl knives around my fingers, roll them around my hands, etc. When I had only 3 acrylics and I was waiting for a shipment, I had the need to work with both hands so I began twirling a knife in one hand while spinning with the other. You tell my brain that wasn't new. I had one half concentrating on spinning and the other half concentrating on twirling and flipping and I guarantee it was new. I gave it up though, because it is hard to spin balls with bandages on your hands. I'm not smart enough to use a dull knife. I have to use the sharpest one I can find.
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silver



Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Posts: 464
Location: bristol, south west england

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 12:53 pm    Post subject:

the 6 ball flower has been done single handedly, i've seen it done once. took the guy(sorry no name) several years to get. i did have some extremely bad footage at one time.

it is possible!

I also heard a pool table fixing guy tell me his mate could do a 3 level 10 ball stack with pool balls one handed. i'd put a truth estimate at 50/50.


it may be possible.........
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Drew



Joined: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 989
Location: Bristol UK

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 2:45 pm    Post subject:

OT: palmspinning
4 in one hand with 4" balls
5 with 80mm
6 in one hand is smooth with 2.5" balls (the other guy who does this is John, he showed me it first about 5 years ago!)
and flat 7 flower in one hand with 2" balls a not so smooth, but it turns
And I have tricks using 9, 10 and 11 3" acrylics in 2 hands.

At the moment, with small balls I have a way to spin 11 2" balls in one hand in a 3 layer pyramid, but only if I cheat !!! I think it is possible though,
but I don't like to work much with small balls !

Dancing with 4 is great though
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The Manipulator



Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 54

Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:50 pm    Post subject:

Drew wrote:

6 in one hand is smooth with 2.5" balls (the other guy who does this is John, he showed me it first about 5 years ago!)
and flat 7 flower in one hand with 2" balls a not so smooth, but it turns
And I have tricks using 9, 10 and 11 3" acrylics in 2 hands.

At the moment, with small balls I have a way to spin 11 2" balls in one hand in a 3 layer pyramid, but only if I cheat !!! I think it is possible though,
but I don't like to work much with small balls !

Dancing with 4 is great though


Awesome! I take it a flower is with one in the center and the others spinning around its outside. I don't know half the names of the moves I do. I have done a little investigating and know what some are called, but I'd prefer to practice rather than spend my time figuring out the names. I can still do it even if I don't know what it's called. So, the 11 ball, 3 layer would go 7 - 3 - 1 per layer I assume. Hmmm, interesting. I haven't tried smaller balls yet, and really don't think I will. My goal is a 6 ball stack in each hand at the same time. Should keep me busy for awhile. How long have you been spinning these jewels? I hope to see some of this in the fall. I'll be the first in line.

You gave me an idea on my 6 ball palm-spin. I'm going to work with 3" on my 5 ball, which should stretch my hand out enough. Thanks again.
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Ryan
Ministry. Just like Colin
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Joined: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 1132
Location: Vancouver

Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:15 pm    Post subject:

<Bump>
Look at the beginning of the thread.
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Colin
It's Fruit of the Loom



Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 2050
Location: UK, Hastings

Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:58 pm    Post subject:

Hmmmm, good call.
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Arnar
i am a......
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Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 2819
Location: arvada CO

Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:15 pm    Post subject:

hmm. very interesting. ive been working on this niffty little body roll for a bout 2 days with my brand new 100mm blue mr.babache stage ball( greatest ball ever! i havent touched my arcrylics or dube since i got it).

its starts off like a chest roll, but then you catch with your chin and let it roll down your body onto your knee , then from there scoop it up with your cradle, or pop the ball back up with your knee. its kinda cool. and sticks mans crazy little head triangle thing i freaking awesome too. i can kinda do it, but its very very very choppy.
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Look!_This_Chånges!
Messing with Heads



Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 753
Location: Underneath my ball

Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:48 pm    Post subject:

*sigh*

Arnar, where did that come from? This isn't the 'I'm working on this move' thread...


My idea:

I'm trying to explore all these things. Multiball, Bodyrolling, and Isolationism (see, I used it's new cool name ).

Isolation, to me, is all about illusion. Nothing more. I find the rest of my body will add to, or increase this illusion. I watch Ryan, Nika, Colin, Drew - pretty much any Isolationist and see that this theory is right. Therefore, by wanting to incorporate my body into the isolation with waves, movement, dance etc, I feel I AM evolving this part of Contact Juggling. [EDIT] I just realised that sound can be used to increase the illusion as well. Those silly robot-esque noises we all make? Why I didn't put his in my post before, I don't know...

Body rolls. Hmm... You roll the ball around your body. That's all there is to it (Speaking in Laymens terms). How can this theory be progressed further? I can't see that the fundamental idea can be pushed further than it already is. However, I like to learn to roll the ball in all sorts of places. I've tried rolling the ball down my legs etc. (There is even a very old Video of me trying this on Youtube...) To me, getting crazy hard body rolls isn't pushing the idea further. It's exploring it, but not pushing it further.

Multiball. To be honest, I'm still at the 'Boring Multiball' stage, so I can't really speak on how to progress this further. IMO, from my own experience of other contact Jugglers, Drew is the Oracle on many balls. Ask him. He'll just say 'it'll be released soon'

My goal as a contact juggler, is to be able to mix all three forms of CJ, successfully, and make it look astounding. It'll be so many years before I even get close to this, but I like the idea of a challenge. You'll notice in the video I recently put out, It wasn't pure isolation. It was playing. I tried to mix in different aspects, like some rolling and isolation. Some worked, some didn't. Oh well. I like to have fun. I love silly moves, moves that make people laugh. CJ, to me, is all about entertainment.I don't wanna just sit there in awe (although that would be pretty cool) I want to add some laughter in there as well, make it seem less of a formal 'watch me do cool and amazing stuff' show, I want a 'play along with me, see my enjoyment' show, as well as the element of 'Wow'... I'm not saying I want to be a clown. I'm saying, add a childish element in there too. Add some cheese. Give the ball more character. The body waves do this (for me) by adding an extra 'invisible force' into the fun.

Yes, I bite something from EVERYBODY I see. I've not been Contact Juggling long (about 16 months now) so I like a little help with what I'm doing. I bite stuff, sometimes change it to suit me, sometimes don't. No big deal. To me, CJ isn't a 'stop copying me' thing, it's a 'try this, and see what you can do with it, See if you can show me some new paths with it'. I heard Colin say once: Contact moves aren't created, they're discovered. That may be a quote of someone else, but I heard Colin say it.

I hope you can see what I mean... :shrug: I can be a bit vague sometimes when putting my point across...
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Last edited by Look!_This_Chånges! on Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:45 am; edited 1 time in total
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Arnar
i am a......
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Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 2819
Location: arvada CO

Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:00 am    Post subject:

im just saying that leg work is possible... and ballguy as a video ( logical fallacy) that shows him doing it
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Colin
It's Fruit of the Loom



Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 2050
Location: UK, Hastings

Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:35 am    Post subject:

*sign* We have established that you can roll a ball anywhere to (just about) anywhere on your body. Forget that for a moment.

I agree with LTC's bit on bodyrolling......
I'm a bodyroller and am exploring new stuff, right. Although I can't find any new parts of my body that have previously escaped my attention. *does a quick once over* nope still have 2 arms, 2 legs, 1 body and 1 head. So what am I supposed to do? Grow a new limb?

This is where that movement of the body, placement, timing, dance, grace, style, character ect stuff comes in. The bigger concepts. (for anyone who cared to read my stupidly long winded posts in this thread) Thats the cutting edge in rolls. Not new moves, though new moves are always welcomed I have been working on one myself for awhile....And BIG respect to peoples out there working on foot to hand rolls

But then its appears that bodyrolls suffer quite badly from the reeling off of tricks upon tricks after more tricks dilemma. Theres not a great deal of context. Just a collection of fancy tricks, If your very very lucky its loosely formulated into some kinda meaningful or logical structure. But hardly ever is very deep or fullfilling. So there lies another of those big chalanges...

As for the dancey stuff:
I'm ripping off every dance form under the sun too. I found its forced me to develope *new* manipulation techniques and reformat things in contact to fit in that style or context. Basicly by exploring this area I have stumbled onto actual tricks or gained better understanding of larger concepts that I would have never of seen. And my awareness of my body controll I learnt from it has gone straight back into my contact and made it much better. So yeah its been worth exploring. And those tuts are the funnest thing I've learnt in a long time.

BUT

it is an alarming trend isn't it!

More bodyrolls please!
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Arnar
i am a......
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Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 2819
Location: arvada CO

Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 1:23 am    Post subject:

hmm. rythmic gymnastics just crossed my mind. they seem to have explored everything.....

now if we can laern from them...
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